The PBK Bhatti and Meeting Virendra Dev Dixit

[clay]

He just appeared in the doorway ... just like that ... unexpectedly ... I went very red ... I don't know why ... he was wearing a brown balaclava over his head with just his face showing ... he had big glasses and the biggest grin you have ever seen ... he beamed around the small room ... so small he was ... so tiny ... such an overwhelming presence ... we moved into another room ... then the drishti ... my mind went still ... there were no thoughts ... just a feeling of absolute peace ... ten seconds ... ten minutes ... ten hours ... I couldn't tell you ... time stood still ... he breathed ... I breathed ... it was perfect peace ... it was heaven.

Then Baba asked us how we had got on in Kampil and we told him about our experiences during the seven day bhatti. He chuckled and chuckled and we laughed and laughed and it was as though we had known each other forever. There was such a feeling of closeness, no physical barriers of platforms or microphones or distance from each other. It was a real family getting together, a family who had been apart for a long time. It was such fun. It was so light, so easy, and yet at times so serious. Baba made us feel as if he had all the time in the world especially for us, three of us had done the bhatti and the gathering was about ten or twelve people in total. It was intimate and it was beautiful.

Baba answered all of our questions and then we all sat around a table and had supper. How could anybody be so ordinary and so extraordinary at the same time. We had spent several hours together and then he left. That was the first time I met Baba, it was in 2004, since then I have had the fortune of several meetings with him and all the experiences have been different.Yet with each meeting, each time there has been the awareness of this great presence.

Always there is the experience of the warmth of love, sometimes there is the experience of law, afterwards there is the feeling of having been coloured with the company of ... well ... complete purity.

There are no rules, there is Shrimat and the freedom to choose. This is how Baba keeps his promise to the children.

Good Wishes, Clay

[uddhava]

Dear Clay,

Thanks for lovely story. Will Virendra Dev Dixit meet anyone, or do you have to submit application forms etc first?

There are no rules, there is Shrimat and the freedom to choose. This is how Baba keeps his promise to the children.

Does this mean that not all PBK's follow Shrimat?

[clay]

Om Shanti Uddava,

It's good to be able to chat again.

Baba(Virendra Dev Dixit) will only meet those children who recognise him through the knowledge he speaks. It's not a case of the power of the personality,it's about recognition of the knowledge. Anyone who wants to meet Baba (Virendra Dev Dixit) to check him out so to speak is barking up the wrong tree. ( I am not suggesting that is the purpose of the question) He does not want anyone to waste their money travelling to India unless they recognise him through the knowledge.

Before anyone goes to Kampil to do the bhatti there has to be an understanding and acceptance of the Trimurti.That is the foundation of the advanced knowledge and it takes some churning to 'get it'. Actually it takes a heck of a lot of churning to really get it, but that is the very process that takes the mind into the Subtle Region, that just means subtle stage. The point of saying this is that the children meet the Father in the subtle stage.That's why in Murli we have every day "the spiritual Father speaks to the spiritual children"

When I came home after that first meeting it was still the knowledge that was all important, the experiences that I described were memorable, but it was, and is, the knowledge that is the real magic. One talks about love a lot, for me the feeling about Baba(Virendra Dev Dixit) is an overwhelming sense of appreciation for the way my mind is being opened. The first time I saw him on video giving classes I thought, this is a great teacher.

Now when I read clarifications that I have not looked at for a month or two I laugh at some of the notes that I made and ask myself how I could have thought that!! That's why it's taking such a risk to try to explain anything in a debate. The PBKs get a bad press for quoting from Murlis but I guess that's the reason we do it. None of us would want to mislead anyone.

Baba is so unassuming, so simple, by looking at him no one would guess in a million years the part he is playing.I have seen him looking so tired, yet still treating his children with infinite love and patience. I hope this has answered the question, sorry if It's gone on a bit!

Good Wishes, Clay

[clay]

Om Shanti Uddhava,

Apologies for the wrong spelling of your name. Sorry, I forgot the bit about Shrimat.

This is an interesting question and of course I can only speak about my own observations and experiences. I guess PBKs are just the same as BKs with our own strengths and weaknesses. But in fact I have realised that one has to be very very careful and check things out with Baba(Virendra Dev Dixit)

As PBKs we have the opportunity to email Baba (Virendra Dev Dixit) and ask for directions, how we interpret those directions will depend on our sanskars, ie the religion we belong to.

I have been in a meeting when a child has had such enthusiasm to do some service that was not entirely in accordance with Shrimat. It was so interesting to see how Baba(Virendra Dev Dixit) handled it. The child was so happy, (and was going to do what he wanted anyway), I learnt alot about being careful what you ask for. Baba will never tell anyone to do anything, we ourselves have to create our own roles. It's amazing to watch this happening,

Good Wishes, Clay

[john]

Hi Clay
Welcome aboard

Now when I read clarifications that I have not looked at for a month or two I laugh at some of the notes that I made and ask myself how I could have thought that!! That's why it's taking such a risk to try to explain anything in a debate. The PBKs get a bad press for quoting from Murlis but I guess that's the reason we do it. None of us would want to mislead anyone.

Are you in a sense saying that there are PBKs joining in on debates not really knowing what they are talking about,so it's easier and safer to just quote Murli points?

[uddhava]

Baba(Virendra Dev Dixit) will only meet those children who recognise him through the knowledge he speaks...

Dear Clay,

Om Shanti. So you mean that someone couldn't just turn up, you would have to fill out an application first and be a pukka PBK. So there is a screening process like in BK. I guess I am wrong but I had the idea that Virendra Dev Dixit was more relaxed than this. I thought I read somewhere that he sometimes tours around and turns up at places unannounced but I guess this means only PBK centres.

I guess I am comparing it to someone like Jesus who would just wander around and speak to anyone and everyone without asking them to fill out application forms first.

[uddhava]

Apologies Uddhava for the wrong spelling of your name

I forgive you but you can always use the 'edit' button. :wink:

[pbktrinityshiva]

Are you in a sense saying that there are PBKs joining in on debates not really knowing what they are talking about,so it's easier and safer to just quote Murli points?

John Bhai,

I cannot speak for clay but from my perspective, PBKs will chose to quote approved information (Murlis/replies from Baba) because its not adulterated with our own opinions or limited by our own intellects. When giving our own explanation we may think it looks correct but the way in which the reader interprets it will be such we have missed out a crucial point/s or have mislead them without meaning to do so. Not to mention everyone is different and some people are better at writing clearly and others not so clear.

Welcome to the forum clay :)

Om Shanti

[bansy]

I cannot speak for clay but from my perspective, PBKs will chose to quote approved information (Murlis/replies from Baba) because its not adulterated with our own opinions or limited by our own intellects. When giving our own explanation we may think it looks correct but the way in which the reader interprets it will be such we have missed out a crucial point/s or have mislead them without meaning to do so. Not to mention everyone is different and some people are better at writing clearly and others not so clear.

So I assume this method of quoting is applying within a complete BK-PBK environment (e.g. this website). The majority of spiritual seekers have to deal with the world at large earning a living, we have to be careful to select what we say on the world stage, but there's is only oneself to rely on, albeit whilst in as much His remembrance (karma Yoga), during the various lokik situations at home, work, on the train, etc. Do we have to check with Baba with almost everything ? Are you not confident and courageous because if you think Manmat is going to halt your progress or conversation without first going through Baba, then it'll probably will, as it's a negative thought. If what comes from your heart and mind, then surely that's good enough for you to deal with in any situation since surely Baba is in your heart and mind.

Hence what is deemed "practical". And also how to quote "practically" when someone is in a non-BK but Spiritual forum and environment, or at World religion seminars and forums, etc. Should BKs/PBKs be there in the first place, if Baba is not there to check the quoting ?

I guess I am moving towards how the children are going to progress as well as reveal the Father, the time of revelation, when they cannot quote what Baba has been supporting with them all along, unless that BK/PBK can recall ALL the Murli/Vani points him/herself.

I am not aiming this at anyone, just commenting on the difference between what is "ordinary" and what is "elevated".

[atma]

Bhai,

Quoting Murli or Avyakt Vani points would not be to productive to those outside of basic knowledge.

They would simply not see the relevance. What I am assuming PBKs are doing is that those who where in basic knowledge can check for themselves with the dates from the Murlis Avyakt Vanis and see it is not simply made up. That the PBKs are not coming up with this on there own. (Cross reference).

They (people in basic knowledge) can then check to see that these hints and points leading towards recognition of Father are there and they simply could have overseen or the points could have been ommitted that is why they where not aware of this.

Of course one would not contact Baba and ask which kind of trousers should I wear but the deeper decisions one might ask for his guidance. Why wouldn't one? If one understands who he is then it would make sense. Last point everything has its place and time so the revelation will take place.

atma

[atma]

Bhai,

Clay thanks for sharing your experience. One day I will find the words to type out my experience as well. You mentioned so many things that I to experienced. It is a very unique and special experience indeed.

atma

[bansy]

Quoting Murli or Avyakt Vani points would not be to productive to those outside of basic knowledge. They would simply not see the relevance. What I am assuming PBKs are doing is that those who where in basic knowledge can check for themselves with the dates from the Murlis Avyakt Vanis and see it is not simply made up. That the PBKs are not coming up with this on there own.

The point I was making in the previous post was how PBKs (and BKs) would conduct themselves outside the BK-PBK environment, people who have not recognised the BK/PBK ShivBaba, if each word and action has to be strictly backed up by a Murli/Vani quote.

In this environment, you cannot use Murlis, say, during a business meeting, so how much manmat would there be when you have to make a decision in such a meeting.

I think the situation used in Murlis/Vanis is to use "common sense". In the limited world, where we are all in, anything you say or do will always be to some extent adulterated or limited. But a 2 year child, often said to be very pure and innocent, without needing to quote Murlis/Vanis, but are able to show and express them in their limited language and vocabulary.

Thus the churning has to be to the extent that, yes you know the Murli/Vani point, BUT ALSO able to express them in the layman language wherever you may be, and NOT be afraid if what you are saying is adulterated or mamnat, otherwise that is the very weakness you are supposed to overcome.

A bit like being a Yoda-like Jedi from Star Wars, above it all but also in it all, and speaks everything almost in reverse order.

[aimée]

If we keep quoting, the conversation is restricted, but if we speak what we think, there is the risk to influence the others with our own vision of Gyan. Let's say this is a tacit understanding amongst us, that except direct quotes and Baba's answers to direct questions.

we cannot avoid to influence each other. we are at the end of the cycle and old and tired, and with a thick layer of body consciousness, we only can be so so very far from truth ... but this is very nice to be able to share, and to see some communication beetwen BK, ex-BK and PBK.
If we were soul conscious at the time of acting in the lokik world, and thinking of Baba, we certainely would do and say the right thing, our "common sense" would be as accurate as can be. That is the main challenge.

In general, If I am aligned with Baba's thoughts, then I am at the end of my journey almost, who considers they are?

[clay]

Om Shanti John Bhai,

First of all thanks for the words of welcome. John Bhai I think pbktrinityshiva gave a good answer to your question, here is what you said

Are you in a sense saying that there are PBKs joining in on debates not really knowing what they are talking about,so it's easier and safer to just quote Murli points?

Is it easier to just quote Murli points ? Well first you have to know them or where to find them, so that is not all together easy... safer ... well yes certainly but the point is from the way I see it, anything I say has no magical quality or poetic quality there is magic in the Murli and clarification of Murli, so why do we want to hear someone else's point of view but I agree with other members of the forum. It would be a bit dry if we did not speak from our own experience as well. I guess balance is a good solution.

Good Wishes

Clay

[clay]

Om Shanti Uddhava Bhai,

Sorry for the delay in replying..Ive been travelling around a bit and I wanted to think about your question, you said

So you mean that someone couldn't just turn up, you would have to fill out an application first and be a pukka PBK. So there is a screening process like in BK. I guess I am wrong but I had the idea that Virendra Dev Dixit was more relaxed than this. I thought I read somewhere that he sometimes tours around and turns up at places unannounced but I guess this means only PBK centres. I guess I am comparing it to someone like Jesus who would just wander around and speak to anyone and everyone without asking them to fill out application forms first

That was the case for Jesus, he came and gave the message of love, forgiveness etc. The Father, ShivBaba ( the permanent Chariot of Shiv in the body of Virendra Dev Dixit) has come to carry out a very different task. The prophet souls came and gave their messages, but the world continued on a downward spiral.

Now man has created weapons of mass destruction, and the scientists tell us if we do not change our way of life we will face the consequences of global warming...the writing is on the wall if anyone wants to read it and heed the warning ... does anyone? So ShivBaba, the Father of all fathers has come to prepare us, to show us how to purify the intellect, to make us understand the greatest story in the world and we do this by becoming manmanabhav. Manmanabhav means to understand the three aspects of time.

" that light of Gyan which is full in Parapita Paramatma is the Gyan of the three aspects of time. When that Gyan of the three aspects of time comes into us children then we can say joti has merged into joti, "joti joti samaya" clarification of Murli 25-3-88

Joti means, Gyan ki joti, the light of knowledge. So the light of understanding only comes with the study of Gyan. Not just knowing about dharna but the in depth study of pure Gyan. "When the soul with its thoughts and vibrations merges into the thoughts and vibrations of Paramatma , that is called the stage of Manmanabhav". So, in my view this will not happen by mingling with the crowd, that's the path of devotion, and devotion as we know makes you fall down.

What is interesting is that the Father repeatedly says he has come to put the urn of knowledge and responsibility on the heads of the mothers. In PBKs the brothers are definitely told to take a back seat. But of course they find it difficult to do so.(sorry brothers) Maybe because the mothers are simply not used to being in front.

The path of knowledge is about study, and in the end I guess it's all about what each person wants and how much effort one is prepared to make. We belong to a Godly University and have the opportunity to study with the greatest teacher in the world , would anyone actually expect to attend class without first having done pretty damn good homework? That is the reason the Father places great emphasis on the children completing the bhatti.

Maybe someone would like to share their experience of the bhatti?

Good Wishes, Clay